Oh not at all offended, I’m glad you jumped into the convo. You obviously have quite a bit knowledge. And it’s always good to have multiple perspectives.
My position has never been that this idea was dumb, or wouldn’t work, or anything else of the sort. But more of a “here’s what I know will work”. You or blzd can have a differing opinion, and I will still try to help any way I can. I’m not here to suggest I know better than anyone else, but I’ll definitely share my experience and any knowledge I have. Whether it be popular or not.
I have no experience bad or good with that particular manufacturer. They may be damn good, or damn good for the price, or no good at all. In that respect, I’ll take your word for it because you seem to know. And I definitely agree that as a hobbyist the latest and greatest isn’t always cost conducive. But when you hear something like “cobs are the way to go” I don’t think it’s typically referring to the cheapest model you can find. Personally, I don’t like that cob defined as a 100 watt cob at all. But apparently they are now following their own standard for modeling the components the same way they model the grow lights.
It’s really not that big of a deal, until someone buys 15 of them thinking they’re gonna have a 1500 watt light. When in reality were looking at around a 450 watt light. You certainly don’t have to deal with that from the name brands. Their 100 watt cobs are 100 watts when run at max current. Not that anyone actually does that, but is what it is I suppose.
Correct me if I am wrong but I was in the impression that the difference in LED top brand and the cheaper ones was quality of diodes, quality of drivers and quality of the heatsink, that’s mostly why cheaper one are not pushing their diodes more than 25 to 50% of their capacity…
Probably some truth to that, but the top names in lighting aren’t really pushing theirs much more than that either. It’s all about finding the balance between efficacy, efficiency, and cost. There’s really no answer that is the best in all 3 cases.
Take the cxb 3590 for example… it’s the most expensive of the normal cobs you would see. For a while, it was the most efficient. But it’s efficiency was only the best when run at low to medium current. It had fairly large drops in efficiency above the 1500ma range. Even though it was rated to run well above that. So when you see someone that essentially has their info together using the 3590, you’ll typically see a lot of them run in the 30-50 watt range. This is the builder opting to spend more on components to have a high efficacy and more efficient light.
The Vero 29 isn’t as good as the Cree in those areas, but the efficiency doesn’t fall off as much at higher current and it’s cheaper. So if you were chasing watts per foot at a lower initial cost, it’s a better option.
The citizen and luminous cobs seem to bridge the gap between the two. I think some of the later models may even be more efficient at a lower cost than the cree. But that will probably be untrue after cree’s next bin release.
Whether anyone is using any particular led to its advantage or not is really up to them. Some may not know any better, others could be doing so for a number of reasons. But I don’t think you will see a whole lot of cobs ran at max current whether it be commercially or by a diy builder. It just doesn’t make sense to do so. Where you may see it, is with some of the mid power strips. The extremely low cost and low heat are probably the biggest reason driving that. The strips are running around 50c without any heatsink at 50% of max current. With something to pull some of the heat, it should be manageable at full current. And if you were to have a failure, you’re looking at as little as $4 to replace. But again, that’s only gaining you watts and total amount of light. It actually drops the efficacy and electrical efficiency. How much and whether it becomes cost efficient to do so really depends on each builder/growers needs.
@Niala pretty sure that’s the “cob” version of light I have in my currently operating grow light. Has red, blue, IR, UV, and warm white. Works good so far.
I just took a peak at your tread and saw that you have a Morsen 3600W equivalent … Probably most of the Chinese brand use those Chanzon COB chips or copy it , that’s why doing your homework before investing is important
When I gone a build mine I will most probably go with the RGB+White+UV+IR
I will not be able to build mine before summer or fall next year, however, if we still around then, I will need your expertise, if it’s ok with you , I have close to no knowledge in building light, and a bit scare when it comes to electricity, lol but can read and follow a good plan
You are correct @dbrn32. The issue was one of the middle LED’s flashed, but didn’t stay on. However, if you tapped on it, and after it heated up, it stayed on. I returned it even though I could have possibly repaired it if I tinkered more with it. I took apart the panel and exposed the drivers, and checked all the connections to it, but it didn’t help, so I returned it. The second one that arrived, had no issues.
That kind of stuff can happen regardless of how much money you spend. And a lot of the components are coming from China too, even from bigger names in led. But it does seem to happen a lot with these lights.
The good thing from a consumer standpoint is that they’re being replaced most of the time. Several members here have had lights replaced without any attempt to be repaired or even being asked to return them. I think that says a lot about the lack of quality, and use of very inexpensive parts. Being cheaper to give them away rather than foot the bill for shipping that is.
I think it’s great that there are inexpensive options for people of walks to try led growing. But I don’t believe a lot of these lights deserve the rave reviews they get. Not that I’m bashing on Chinese lights. But some are a good value, and others are just plain cheap. In my eyes, there’s a pretty big difference between the two.
@dbrn32 I attempted at somewhere down the middle. Quality, value, and effectiveness. I’ll admit I was pretty lost when it came to lighting until I found this sight. It’s also my first grow. But $37.50 per LED light, I thought was mostly affordable. I just couldn’t spend $3K on a light that would do the same thing with China parts most likely in the inside. I agree the reviews are worthless most of the time.
I just hope this light works well, for the price that I paid.
And that’s the thing that really makes more, there are some really expensive lights that aren’t worth $hit compared to some half their price.
One of the biggest issues is that so many of the lights good or bad, are designed for commercial applications or 4x4 grow area. And not everyone has that size space. That’s where building can be really handy. You’re able to use the same components, and build to you’re lighting needs that will fit in your space. It’s not something everyone can or will do, but it’s definitely within reason for most. That turns a $1000 light into more like $5-600 in a lot of cases.
@dbrn32 I don’t mind looking at the commercial applications, because my area is a 4X8 and a lot of grow operations happen to be about the same width as mine. You’re right, I looked a lot expensive lights, and did comparisons with more affordable light solutions, and what I found is you can easily purchase comparable for half the cost, if you can match output and wavelength numbers. The fixtures that are really expensive you pay for the name usually. Just my $1.00 worth.
Yup, and a few of them the names don’t even mean much. A few of those bigger companies have left some customers high and dry.
Assuming You’re not running that full from wall to wall, I’m more use to smaller areas. But same ideas apply. If you’re looking for the most bang for your buck in a commercial type fixture, check out plc-6 from pacific light concepts. Would be enough to probably cover half the tent in a scrog type grow.
No, not running it all the way across. Everything fits on one side of the 4x4 tent. I’ll be ordering another to make it a more equal 6 plants per light to give them proper spacing and more lighting. The PLC-6 is out of stock already…
If it was something you’re interested in, I’d call them and see what’s up. The owner was a grower first, and I believe worked for one if those big companies. I’d bet he’d get guys like us a fixture if he can.
Just a thought. If you had other plans that’s fine too. @Covertgrower
I sometimes fly by the seat of my pants! @dbrn32 I may give them a call, just to see. If I don’t make plans set in stone, I can never be disappointed! That’s how I make it through life with a positive attitude. Lol
I think there are some detailed reviews and some test data available around online. Check them out. If it turns out to be something you like, there are some similar options available from timber. They just don’t have the commercial finishings.
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